Political Staples

…is there anything that is strictly a familial responsibility?

Booya, Staples.

What is the legal status of the current program? Do they actually even need to pass legislation to defund it in year 2 and later? The Conservatives will pass the $1200 in a separate bill from defunding, if defunding is even required. They want to be seen to keep their promises or let their government die trying.

“This was not a small process. This was a large process that engaged every province and territory, that engaged hundreds of stakeholder groups, parents et cetera. And the prevailing view was that we needed a child-care system in Canada…”

Funny - I don’t remember a thing about it. I am sure Ken Dryden wandered around flapping his gums - but he wasn’t “engaging” anybody, or identifying the “prevailing view” - he was selling a program. I suppose some of the present and future client groups put in appearances, and liewise tried to sell their scheme; but I don’t remember anyone asking Canadian parents what they thought, or trying to identify the consensus outside that narrow group who sought either to benefit from the available funds or obtain a position managing the money (and claiming some credit) as it flowed through the system.

A policy engendering dependency on the state for the basic functions of the family achieves negative results? I for one am shocked.

And what of those who do need this type of program (ie. single mothers)? While I can agree that those who can afford to pay for it, should pay for it, the Conservative plan simply fails those who can’t. No single mother is going to get daycare for $1200 a year and without adequate daycare would be forced to stay at home and collect welfare.

For an even better and more decisive summary, see today’s Financial Post Comment page piece by your fellow KW-er Peter Shawn Taylor, “Scrap Liberal daycare deals”.

It may or may not be difficult for Harper to change this, I don’t know enough to assess it (although Taylor’s arguments are convincing). But I wouldn’t take at face value an assertion from someone with the job title, “Minister of Community Resources and Employment”. The very existence of her job is opposed to the choice in childcare, non-statist view. Of course she’s going to make dire predictions about reversing Stalinist Liberal central plans.

Robert. I have always said that I would support a day care plan if it had a cap based on family income. Pick a number say 40-45K. Anybody below that qualifies and gets to the front of the line. Anybody either goes to the back of the line with clawbacks or is disqualified.

This is not what we are talking about though.

And by the way, any ad hominem or personal attacks and I will ban you again. I have zero tolerance for that.

Am I the only one who found the CD Howe report unconvincing?

The two things that stood out for me was the conclusion there was a 40% payback because women were now working and that the kids in daycare exhibited unruly behaniour.

Unruly behavour?

I am no friend of the idea of Daycare Canada (TM), but that’s the best they could come up with?

JasperPants

What about the single mother(or father)? If she lives where I do she is screwed anyways, many in rural areas would be. Even if she is within an area she must win the “daycare” lottery to get that spot or she receives nothing.

As awful as this sounds, what happened to some personal responsibility? I got married in the early 80’s but already was practical enough to tell myself “what if it doesn’t last like so many others?” Had our son, knew that was likely all we should have, but decided one more and then called it quits. We went through about five years of around $100 for our food budget, unbelievable how creative you have to be! We didn’t run around screaming that someone should support us, we worked harder, those were our kids and our responsibility. In 1986 we almost called it quits and I prepared to become a single mom, financial situation would not have changed for me since hubby’s business was bleeding out already, I was making the money, not alot either. We decided to try one more year and yes, it turned around, but that was our decision. Not once did it enter our minds that we should be seeking freebies for our kids and expect someone else to pay for them.

We made a permanent decision NOT to have more children, they are too expensive! Should society have to pay for our poor judgement had we proceeded otherwise? One more would have put us in the welfare line, we said NO! The public already pays for plenty of things for kids, schools and hospitals are not cheap to run, why add to this?

It would be nice if before people had any children they were forced to sit down and make a financial plan which would include “what happens if I become a single parent?” If you are unable to provide an answer, other than welfare or you hope for the best, then don’t have children! So many people behave like parents had a gun put to their head and were forced to have their kids so therefore society must step in to raise them. I know many people who chose not to have any children now, some due to personal reasons but most due to practical reasons.

I know many great single parents, my mom was one of them, who work their butts off and do their best. The $1200 may cover one or two months of child care but they will stay pay the bulk of the costs. At least everyone would get something to help instead of hoping they “win” or get nothing at all.

I do believe that social assistance should be available, sometimes sh*t happens, but there would be alot less need for it if people would think things through first instead of letting their emotions rule everything. Something like this post of mine. ;-)

Greg, you are right in pointing out that a cap would at least be more acceptable for everyone, including me, but that was never proposed so this program is not workable. I could see the headlines “National Daycare Program balloons to ten times the estimated cost, most cannot use it and now parents who do use it must find alternative arrangements because unionized workers are on extended strike, they want a 15% increase!”

This is not what we are talking about though.

But that is what we should be talking about. Instead of each of us blindly defending one of the three flawed plans, we should be working out a workable one to sell to the public and our government.

And a workable system is child’s play. It should be based on family after tax income levels. For example;

Under 30,000: 100% of daycare cost is subsidized. 30,000-40,000: 75% of daycare cost is subsidized. 40,000-50,000: 50% of daycare cost is subsidized. etc. etc. This is just an example of the financial breakdown but the exact details of how much subsidizing is required based on income is a minor detail.

As for who will deliver the service, I see no reason that the private sector can’t handle it. They’ve been doing so for quite some time and as long as there are sufficient regulatory laws and oversights in place to insure adequate credentialling for their workers and to see that safety concerns are met, then there’s no reason they can’t continue to do so.

Voila, a national daycare program that actually works is born. And this is what we should be talking about.

“No single mother is going to get daycare for $1200 a year and without adequate daycare would be forced to stay at home and collect welfare.”

Precisely Robert. Bravo for making the point. That’s why all single mothers in this poor excuse for a country are currently on welfare.

Robert, what you are proposing is an increase to the tax credits that are already available for day care. There must be more to all of this or why wouldn’t they (I mean the Liberals at the time) choose this?

Robert, subsidized daycare exists across Canada already.

The CPC plan to provide tax credits for opening new spaces (I think it’s 8 or 10k first year startup costs, the space itself is self-funding) should just be opened up to include provinces that have ACTUALLY CREATED spaces vs. signed an agreement.

Just out of curiousity, which provinces signed first? When (I seem to recall agmts as early as last spring)? Where are the spaces??????

It’s just another boondoggle IMHO.

No, Robert, $1200 isn’t going to pay for a full year, but it will help. It give’s parents a choice. For people on welfare, most jurisdictions have subsidized day care and they would still get the money.
The Conservative plan also calls for employers to create new spaces so that parents can interact with their kids at work. The Liberal plan also does not address shift workers, which make up a large portion of our work force. These workers usually rely on family members or sitters and the $1200 would also go a long way to offset those costs. The Liberal claim that a national institutionalized system would give kids a head start is also bunk. While studies have shown that early childhood education does give kids a head start in K and Grade 1, by Grade 3 these advantages are nonexistent. While I strongly feel that child rearing is a family responsibility, at least the Conservative plan recognizes and provides assitance for parents who choose to raise their kids at home.

I am middle age male taking a graduate political course at night. The whole class was crapping on the conservatives for daycare policies. When I suggested USER PAY, everyone slammed me. When I suggested many were dropping their babies off from their SUVS, they shamed me to slink into my chair. NOT true they yelled nobody drops their kid off at daycare in SUV.

Under 30,000: 100% of daycare cost is subsidized. 30,000-40,000: 75% of daycare cost is subsidized. 40,000-50,000: 50% of daycare cost is subsidized. etc. etc.

Interesting idea as far as it goes, but what about those families who don’t want institutional daycare? Are their childcare choices any less valid? Are they any less worth supporting?

I just did some digging. AB has a “Kin” plan & will pay up to $300/month for in-home family care, which I think is kind of cool. You probably have to qualify for the subsidy (it looks like it’s geared toward shift workers & students), but I think it’s a good idea.

I didn’t know Alberta did that, it is a good idea! Is this common knowledge? Wonder what other provinces, if any, provide?

I stand by that being a parent is all about choice. You choose to be one then spend 20+ years making thousands more decisions regarding them. In the end you hope to see a good result from all of this not observe the product of state run political correctness gone askew. I chose to place my kids where I thought best suited our needs AND values not what the government said they were. By the way, I had to work most Saturdays, never saw a daycare open then or now.